Board Thread:Questions and Answers/@comment-216.67.118.209-20160331011253/@comment-30255782-20191005101708

You were talking about best states? Oh okay, I wasn't gonna count aer or asi tf since we're talking about an early or maybe midgsme player as far as I can tell. Yeah only, he has no survivability so after that range he's dead. Meanwhile, mitama has instant backswing after one of her 20 kbs with her over 100k hp, then she goes back to +50% uptime slowing everything with ld.

Ofc it doesn't negate anything, but if you have a better way and it'd actually work, then it'd be quite the improvement to the bc community, it's not like people will refuse to change if they see something better. So say which type of uber they are (backline/generalist/etc) and which ones dominate their niches the most, flabber already kinda had the 2nd one down before he removed all those rankings from his Tierlist (and mine has already dome the first one basically completely). Having ways to know immediately what kind of unit they are, and what the best units for each niche are would be quite helpful. I may add that 2nd one to mine since it sounds like you don't want to make such a thing,  thx lol.

Although, you do disagree later on: "anyone with an uber can see if it's good or bad." Well then, since everyone is a bc mastermind like yourself and tests each of their units, we don't even need the Tierlist lol. New players should just know what each of their units does, and should already know how much improvement it'll get in tf and how well it does against parts of the game they haven't reached yet... Ofc...

Sure, you don't need someone to tell you how good your unit is, but it's certainly helpful, similar to the Tierlist itself. No, people typically can't just tell if an uber is good or not by themselves, that's quite rare and usually results in some odd biases. Indeed, if you need anti black you bring anti black, but like you pointed out before, it'd be helpful to know what the best ubers in whatever niche are, so you can know if your unit is good there.

The thing that should be obvious to people is that if they have 5 generalists, then they don't need more unless they only have bad ones, and it'd be preferable to aim for a different type of unit. This should be self intuitive, so you shouldn't need to tell people what things to go for, just what type of ubers they have should be sufficient (unless the new guy is very dense, then he'll need further help).

Indeed you can, you can say whatever you want, and I'll say that the wrong things you say are wrong. "most of the Tierlist" is indeed not a reason for it to be a rule, it's evidence that you've got it pretty accurate when most skilled players can agree with most of it tho. So it's certainly a reason for it to be considered a pretty accurate guideline that's good at doing what it does.

Chronos is in the top of B+, and moving her to A is argued quite a bit, so unless you think she deserves the top of A or something, I don't see her being underrated. It doesn't matter how much people talk about a unit, are miyabi and Subaru C- because they aren't talked about? Or is it just that they aren't talked about but are placed accurately? There's no relation there, the relationship is with people knowing much about the unit or not, not about their Tierlist position. Nobiluga is indeed bad, he gets the job done if you have nothing else with range, and in a tiny niche that won't be very significant. Paladin works as an anti metal, but he's not near the best at it among the ubers in his niche, and he's useless outside of niche. Yep, he's bad according to the methodology, and he's bad anyway, any of the anti metal focused units except verbena can outclass him, especially since the cc non ubers are worse than the crit non ubers, so metal cc is more of a help in general.

If you wanna argue against the methodology, then we need a better way of ranking ubers that won't cause 'problems' like this. Sorry if you wanna say it's a childish, stupid argument. But if we don't have any methodology better than out current one, than I have no idea how one would argue that we should not use the current one, unless they believe that's its utterly useless or is highly inaccurate, and I don't think you're going that far.

The thing is that Gao isn't 'decent' at everything, if you have him, then you don't need another generalist cuz he's the best at that, also he's the best or the 2nd best among midrangers. This is why he's SS, because he's the best at multiple things. Ofc, I'd rather have 20 different niches than 20 of the same purpose units. The secret with generalists tho, is that every unit has a niche, and generalists are just helpful enough in any stage that it outshines their general use. Vars is still great for black/relic, nurse is still good for floating/black, and some units that are solid in general are even better in niche, and so they get quite high, like momo/Saru. The only case where this isn't true are the units that have most of the game as their niche (ama/arma/dart/gao), but these units are pretty insane anyway, since their special abilities make them so solid for anything and everything, so they can cover any gaps in niches you have. Gao is higher because he works better than Gaia, her survivability, multihit (it's spaced enough that it isn't that bad), and small ld prevent her from being top tier, she's not far off tho, she's sti S. He's a disappointment cuz he's higher than ama/Arma, do you wanna argue that he's less useful than them, or just isn't enough better? He's enough better to be better than every unit between ama and himself, and that's enough.